Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 09-19-2010, 10:55 PM   #21
wingnut60
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Where we park it
Posts: 2,838
On a completely lighter note----porkchop has 3 or 4 posts in this thread, how come his post count remains at 5?

Joe
__________________

__________________
2016 Tiffin 40 QBH
2015 38RSSA, traded
2005 TK3 #1869, 10 yrs of memories,
2017 F450 KR--one more Ford is it
2009 F450 4x4-died; 2010 F450-retired
wingnut60 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2010, 06:33 AM   #22
Charlie and Sue
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Bergen,N Y
Posts: 36
ouch! Porky, I have had work done by Paul and was very satisfied with his crew, I am now at the point of trading my unit for new. But haven't decided what yet, going to N.Y.S. show this weekend to look around.

Charlie and Sue
__________________

Charlie and Sue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2010, 06:06 PM   #23
porkchop
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 382
I do apologise to every one I offended. I know I came out a little strong.
Sorry to all.
I know that DRV does make mistakes. I did not mean to imply that they don't. So does Microsoft, and the space shuttle. Still pretty good products though.
I do believe that feed back is necessary to inprove any product.
I have never been to Paul's shop and have no idea what kind of work his employees turn out. I do know that when he was at DRV he was a jerk. I had previously told my dealer that I would not buy another DRV because of him. I was happy to see him go. My dealer also sells several other very good brands. I feel it is the dealer, his shop and employees that really matter. Larry has never let me down. I called my dealer today and discussed having someone else do the PDI. He said that was part of his commission for selling the unit.
I think he is more than qualified to supply this service. Everyone in the chain has to make a profit, or they will not be there next time.
I have noticed on most of these forums the majority of people want more, and better quality.Me too. From all the manufactures. I'm sure the good ones would be more than happy to do that. It would improve their reps. But someone has to pay for it. McDonalds would probably want to pay double the wage and get better employees. No one wants to pay double the price though. We have to find a balance that makes us, as individuals, happy.
porkchop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2010, 06:37 PM   #24
RickandJanice
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 119
WOW! This post really got out of control. :oops:

All I was trying to say was how disappointed I am in the way DRV and Hehr are now handling the window issues. I also find it disappointing that they were replacing windows out of warranty at no charges earlier this year and suddenly they are not. Depends on who is handling the claim? Customer service seems to change with the warranty reps. at both companies. Have worked with two other at DRV and one other at Hehr in the past and was never treated this cold or uncaring.

We bought our unit new from the dealer in '07 even though it is an '06. So it is not as far out of warranty as some may think. Yes, I understand that it is out of warranty and neither company has to do anything legally. I have followed DRV since their inception as a division of Sunnybrook. I have always believed in the quality of their design and construction. I just hate to see their suppliers hide behind their warranty when there is a problem that can't seem to be fixed.

I never said we would not buy another DRV. We did however, buy this unit for the "long haul" and have no intentions of buying another anytime soon. If we did, I would reconsider paying extra for double pane windows again. We would still buy a DRV because they are still the best product for the price and I still believe in their overall construction.
__________________
Rick and Janice Binns
2006 MS 32TK3, Mor/Ryde Pin Box and I.S., Auto Level-Up
2012 Ford F450 6.7 L Diesel, air bags and 25K Reese Signature hitch (factory installed)
RickandJanice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2010, 01:43 PM   #25
bstark
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Fergus, Ontario, CANADA
Posts: 1,000
RickandJanice; how did it transpire that YOU are having to defend your position as stated with your posting? You have been given no relevant reason to explain your position regarding the windows in your rig.
These forums exist for the reasons of informing others of their problems and hopefully solutions to those problems.
A poster who assume the position that you are being unreasonable in your expectations is not unusual, however, it could have been put more delicately without the personal reference to "DRV being better off without those types of customers"! That is uncalled for and excusing that behaviour is also.

Reference to any individual regardless if it's Paul Cross or anyone else in relation to this topic is also inexcusable as is throwing out the admonishment that anyone "defending him is getting compensated for it"!
Good grief, all of this comes spewing forth and it's my post that gets described as "taking it personal".

Porkchop: way back when this forum first got off the ground we had a couple of vehement cheerleaders of the Doubletree product that would leap to the defense of the breed at the least little reference that the trailer's could stand some improvements 'quality wise'. They even managed to get two posters banned from the forum for posting much less in the way of criticism than we are witnessing today. I certainly hope we are not witnessing a rebirth of that mentality. Your excusing all of the above arrogant behaviour with the time worn "I'm entitled to my opinion" blanket coverage just doesn't wash and I'm entitled to my opinion also
.
This company does not need your defending of their product by castigating those who would post negatives. They have, and will continue to do well without your help in that regard.
__________________
Sandra, Bruce
bstark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2010, 02:29 PM   #26
5thwheeler
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 270
Big Breath Everyone

I am a great fan of lively discourse, but......................
we're getting WAY off topic.
So let's finish up this 'other' discussion, and take a big breath.

Those who wish to discuss the original Hehr window problem - please continue.

Thanks
Attached Images
File Type: gif chillout_133.gif (33.4 KB, 110 views)
5thwheeler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2010, 05:18 PM   #27
bstark
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Fergus, Ontario, CANADA
Posts: 1,000
Michael; you are of course correct and I'll tender my apologies to the O/P and also Porkchop for breaking one of my own rules of personal decorum.
__________________
Sandra, Bruce
bstark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2010, 05:22 PM   #28
JOHN EVANS
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 114
what was the topic again ?
JOHN EVANS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2010, 06:47 PM   #29
lnklatt
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 17
We have a 2005 32TK3 with dual pane windows fogging. Individuals posting comments to this issue have indicated they replaced the windows themselves. Has anyone written a procedure on how to accomplish this task? If yes, I'd like to receive that information.

Of the folks that have had them replaced by a commercial shop or DRV what typical cost are we looking at? Most of the dual pane windows on our unit have fogged, so I expect this to be a significant cost.
lnklatt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2010, 07:25 PM   #30
RickandJanice
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 119
I have only replaced the vent windows so far. This does not involve removing the entire window and is very simple to do. If anyone needs directions on how to replace the vent window, please let me know. I'll let someone else try to explain how to remove the entire window. There area allot of postings on this forum and the S.O.I.T.C. forum but because I have not replaced an entire window, will not even try to explain any of it.
__________________
Rick and Janice Binns
2006 MS 32TK3, Mor/Ryde Pin Box and I.S., Auto Level-Up
2012 Ford F450 6.7 L Diesel, air bags and 25K Reese Signature hitch (factory installed)
RickandJanice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2010, 09:59 PM   #31
wingnut60
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Where we park it
Posts: 2,838
window replacement

I did the rear window, the couch-side windows, the dinette slide windows, the desk window and the escape window. It is a relatively simple, but not necessarily easy, task. I am assuming you will be replacing the PANE only, not the window frame.

Just start with a smaller one first to get used to the process---get a small hook tool to get under the black rubber gasket at one of the lower square corners, and start pulling it out all the way around to the other end. Then pull out the gasket across the bottom. (This is for the upper, non-opening part--the crankout parts are replaced with the metal frames on them already). With the gaskets out of the grooves, be standing on a ladder/stool that allows you to be even with the window. Have a friend or DW inside and push outward on the top of the window carefully--the pane of glass will come out easily and you just have to catch it before it falls.
This was the easy part. You then have to clean off all the old sealant (glazing) material--but it kind of rolls up in balls if you start pushing it with a finger--sometimes you need a flat blade, but be careful, the aluminum frame is very soft and easy to gouge. Once the sealant area is clean, you are ready to apply the rope glaze around the window where you took off the old sealant. This is an odd material to get used to handling--it is in a roll with a paper between the rows. Start anywhere along the frame where the old sealant was and carefully unroll the rope--this is sometimes almost a 3-handed operation for a newbie--and be sure to work in the shade to keep the rope from getting sticky. Just be sure and get some of the rope along all the frame area. When you think you have a good seal all around the frame, you are ready to consider putting in the new pane.
Look closely at the bottom groove--there are spacers in the groove that are there to position the pane vertically--you need all new spacers and just put new ones in next to the old ones. Not enough spacers and the window will settle into the groove, leaving a gap at the top--even with new spacers, the big window in the rear ended up with a 1/2" gap that I had to fill with silicone to prevent leaks. Some of the windows also have side-to-side spacers.

The first window is the hardest, in that you are getting used to new things--if you were in the window business, you could do all the windows in about 2 hours. The rear window is the heaviest and needs two sets of hands outside to position it.

I did 7 windows over 2 days with very little help, but I am going to the factory next week to have them all repositioned to correct the tendency of the panes to settle to the bottom leaving a gap.

To do the crank-out portion is a little different, in that you are only working with mechanical items, not gaskets/sealants, since the crank-out windows already have the frames on them. Crank the window out, remove the 'c' clip on the hinge/arm, pry off the arm and lift the section out of the channel across the top. Reverse the process and you are done.
Getting the channels to match can be a hassle, but not too hard.

Whatever you do, DO NOT bang/hammer/pry on the aluminum frames of the crankouts as they bend easily. 2 of the ones I replaced are not closing correctly and have to be pushed in from the outside. Another item for DRV to fix.

The hardest part of all is getting the measurements correct--Tom Peck walked me thru that and caught a couple mistakes I made. If you get the windows sent to you, be sure and get an ample supply of spacers--twice what they say you need--and use them with enthusiam for numbers, or the new panes will settle.

Good luck.

I have some pictures that I had problems posting-----I could try to email them direct if anyone is interested. Send me you email address and I will try to get them sent back to you.

Joe
__________________
2016 Tiffin 40 QBH
2015 38RSSA, traded
2005 TK3 #1869, 10 yrs of memories,
2017 F450 KR--one more Ford is it
2009 F450 4x4-died; 2010 F450-retired
wingnut60 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2010, 05:16 PM   #32
berghild
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: EVERYWHERE
Posts: 291
Send a message via AIM to berghild
I have problems with windows too.
Pork Chop probably noticed over the last 3 years I have posted problems often....but I do it because I need some help that the forum can supply.....not to whine.
I love my "home" and would do it again....and sometimes it does seem that my rig is not a good advertisement. A lot of my problems have beens solved in the new units.
A few years ago when I ordered a Holiday Rambler the rep talked me out of dual pane windows....big mistake! At that time (2002) he spoke of how the seal fails because of the twisting and bouncing that these windows take. With the problems and all with these windows I would STILL order the dual pane windows. Cyndy
__________________
CYNDY AND HOWARD
2004 SIVERADO DURAMAX 3500
4X4 DRW
EDGE CHIP,exhaust brake,ATS tranny, ATS turbo, AFE sir filter
ETC
2008 36TK3 ES3917/no granite
berghild is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2010, 07:01 PM   #33
JOHN EVANS
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 114
we are currently having 2 windows replaced at Pauls and other work also. We have had minor problems with ours and i have posted the problems on here. We would buy another 1 but not from the dealer we bought this 1 thru. Paul and his crew are the only ones i will allow to work on ours, i trust him,his work is first rate, his prices are fair. Someone recently suggested that we should file a class action suit against Hehr because of their poor quality windows.
JOHN EVANS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2010, 06:56 PM   #34
JOHN EVANS
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 114
John:

There have been two (2) programs. One program Hehr covered material, freight and a labor allowance. The current program they supply glass at cost, no freight, no labor.

I helped negotiate the first program not the second. The first program was routed through DRV, we paid the bill and charged back to Hehr. This can’t be done with the second program.





Best Regards,

Tom Peck

Customer Service Manager

260-562-1075
JOHN EVANS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2010, 08:25 PM   #35
porkchop
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 382
Class action suits of most kind can have unintended results.

In this case Hehr makes the vast majority of rv windows in the states. Every owner of any rv could be included in a settlement. Hehr will settle out of court because of the cost of defending their engineering and manufacturing. It will probably cost them millions, but it will still be cheaper for them. Or they close thge doors and walk off.

The money obtained will first pay the lawyers expences. Then their fees. Then every rv owner with a Hehr product will split the remainder. A few dollars apiece at best. Plus when you join the law suit you automatically forfit any and all other claims.

At this point everyone would be far better off working the best deal they can and leave the lawyers sleep.

I really wonder what percentage of their products fail. I have personally owned 2 DRV units and 2 other brands. Put a lot of miles on them all and never had a failure. I may be just lucky. Don't know.
Any one have any figures?
porkchop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2010, 08:31 PM   #36
BlueSkyRanch
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Jupiter, FL
Posts: 102
The Hehr window problem is an industry wide problem that will continue unless every RV manufacturer steps up and says enough. There must be a manufacturer out there who will make a quality product.
__________________
Steve
BlueSkyRanch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2010, 10:20 PM   #37
wingnut60
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Where we park it
Posts: 2,838
porkchop,
you are correct in how most class-action suits end up--money for the lawyers, very little to complainants.
But I don't think the Hehr situation rises to the level that would attract a lawyer to go for it.

Now, if enough customers would demand a different mfg before buying, THAT would have an effect. Why do you think DRV changed to Michelin tires?

Does anyone know of other window mfgs for rvs? Have had at least 7 different rvs and can't recall any other name.

Joe
__________________
2016 Tiffin 40 QBH
2015 38RSSA, traded
2005 TK3 #1869, 10 yrs of memories,
2017 F450 KR--one more Ford is it
2009 F450 4x4-died; 2010 F450-retired
wingnut60 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-2010, 09:53 AM   #38
Motor31
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 2,130
DRV now installs tires with a 55 MPH speed limit rating?
__________________
Mike Nancy and the fuzzies
Fulltiming since June 2004
Volvo 660 MH tow vehicle
2005 MS 38RL
2007 Saturn Ion "toad"
2010 Gold Wing "piggyback"
Motor31 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-2010, 10:08 AM   #39
wingnut60
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Where we park it
Posts: 2,838
I believe they are the Michelin X ATX Load Range J that I put on my unit 2 years ago. They are rated by Michelin at 62 mph. Your speeds may vary...

Joe
__________________
2016 Tiffin 40 QBH
2015 38RSSA, traded
2005 TK3 #1869, 10 yrs of memories,
2017 F450 KR--one more Ford is it
2009 F450 4x4-died; 2010 F450-retired
wingnut60 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2010, 09:04 AM   #40
BlueSkyRanch
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Jupiter, FL
Posts: 102
I have the "H" rated tires that are rated for 80mph. Very nice tire. With every RV I've owned except this one, I've upgraded the tires by 1 load rating with great results. My 2010 38TKSB3 is the first one that I feel confident in the load rating of the tires. DRV did a great job.
__________________

__________________
Steve
BlueSkyRanch is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:14 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×